...[..in the story when they threw you out of the house] {….} I sat in this room, {…}, oy vey [You look good, Saba] {Is this recording?} [Yes] What.., these were such words th.. he and I rejoiced very much in every word And he was very tired [Who, Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner)?] This.., no.. this is Yaakov [Ahh..]… ...They do not know, if they do not know [I am writing down..] Ah.. [Your parents threw you out of the house, and you went and lived near Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) It was for the good, so that you could see Rebbe Yisroel’s avodah] Yes [What else was there?] {…} Certainly I wa.., I was with him and.. {..} [You can speak Yiddish] Yes? [Yes] There was th..{..}, my room was.. near his apartment, near his apartment, {….} certainly it was.. something different, something different, to be with him always Oy vey, {..}… ...Nu, in the meantime, I am not telling everything [What?..] {..}, in this, in this there was th.. story, there was a story I became.., Hashem sent me an illness [An illness?] Yes, of the intestines [Of the intestines?] Of the intestines, of the intestines The tongue with the palate, with.., the whole mouth was.. {.…} It was an illness; what does illness mean? - that the flesh rotted, that it rotted.. [The flesh rotted] Eh? [The flesh rotted, the flesh rotted] The flesh was rotten from the sores, from the mouth.. [Rotten from the sores] Ah.. and.. and.. and.. eh? [From the sores] {…}, no, there was an illness {from the intestines\from the mouth}, {not the sores} In any case, I did not make use of doctors, I did not want doctors, {and so it was} It was an illness.. very terrible; I felt great suffering {.….}, the heart was.., pie.., pieces, pieces of the flesh that fell, then it fell

And.. I was.., then I was in great danger, the intestines and the heart, it was, it was.. {doso, good} And the heart was also ill, the intestines and the heart In any case, it {went (intensified)}, I could not eat, each time I became weaker And.. I lost my strength {..}.. arrived.., after I became very weak, then arrived.. ah.. Yom Kippur, Yom Kippur Nu, on Rosh Hashanah we are, by Rabbainu, by Rebbe Shimon, we are at the tziyun, or i.. On Rosh Hashanah, but Yom Kippur, if one cannot, then not The point is: I saw.. {..} that I had to be at home I said to Rebbe Yisroel: "I cannot; if I go outside it will be terrible" {…..} I could not bear the {…..}, only when I would go out, then the {…..} {….} The point is: the eve of Yom Kippur, the eve of Yom Kippur I remember that Rebbe Yisroel.. Rebbe Yisroel’s house was next to me, next to me {…} The eve of Yom Kippur What are you doing? The point is: Rebbe Yisroel traveled to Meron for Yom Kippur, and I remained alone, sick like this I kn.., knew Rebbe Yisroel; on Yom Kippur I arrived in Meron Will I be here? Will I be here in Tzfas without.., wi.. without Rebbe Yisroel? The point is: I am forbidden even to go out of the house "Then whatever will be, will be, {give thanks to Hashem}” I went out, and I did not say at home that I was traveling to Meron; would she agree to let me travel? I said nothing, went out.. {..}, went out She was astonished – how am I going out, how am I going out of the house In any case, I went to a Sephardi who has a donkey, and there, ah.. One needs to travel to Meron; they go to him and he travels to Meron, they pay him for this, he readies the donkey and I went to..{…}.., ah..

All those who traveled to Meron were Rebbe Yisroel and I, but, but they knew The point is: I went to that Sephardi; I had no money, I went to this Sephardi I asked the Sephardi: "Will you travel to Meron? After all, it is the eve of Yom Kippur {…...….}” We arrived there on the eve of Yom Kippur The point is: ah.. {..}, ah.. then he said: "Will you give such and such?" "Yes" By Rebbe Yisroel, do I have money? I did not tell him.., Rebbe Yisroel I did not tell him that I had no money; he wants such and such I hired him.. he traveled with me to be with Rebbe Yisroel in Meron {Nu..} so he traveled with me, but I.., the illness was terrible I cannot go out of the house; now to make a journey from Tzfas to Meron On a donkey, and I was so weak The point is: ah.. for money.. {oy, oy, oy, oy, oy}, {…..} money, the money In any case, I traveled with him; with difficulty, with difficulty I made it along the road, and it was so bad I do not know how {….} the journey; in any case, {….} We arrived in Meron, and when we arrived in Meron {..}.. it is necessary to be.., receive money, receive money I said to Rebbe Yisroel, {…} I will give you, I will give you, I will give you.. money Rebbe Yisroel, Rebbe Yisroel, Rebbe Yisroel saw me, so he became forceful He knows that I am ill, I am forbidden to go outside, into the air, I am forbidden to go out The point is: "I am already here, the eve of Yom Kippur, what can be done?" So I said to him: "One needs to pay the Sephardi, for the donkey" Nu, Rebbe Yisroel did not have money, {…} So th.., so there was, so there was one of our fellowship, the wealthy man of Tzfas, Rebbe Nassan Trovitze He would travel; he and the son and the family traveled for Rosh Hashanah

And for Yom Kippur they traveled once again, traveled once again Rebbe Yisroel approached.. Rebbe Nassan, and said to him: “Yisroel Ber arrived with a donkey, and it has to be paid, has to be paid, it costs such-and-such” He was stingy, he became ‘angry’ “What does that mean? They travel at his expense, they pay such a price?” Nu, he became ‘angry,’ one way or another, it was the eve of Yom Kippur, he had to ask him He took out cash and gave it to him for my journey [And what was with you? You were sick] The point is.. Yom Kippur, I do not know how, {Hashem kept me alive} I did not know whether I was at Rebbe Yishmaon, or, or.. And I knew nothing of what was happening with me, and such suffering that it was impossible to endure I did not pray, nu, that is how my Yom Kippur was, I did not pray at all {…}, only.. {…}, but baruch Hashem I fasted At any rate, then Rebbe Nassan saw how I looked, {….} Rebbe Yisroel, ah.. “This is not {an ordinary} illness, one does not do such a thing” He saw that I knew nothing {….} in the world at all {….} perhaps dead To bring him to the cemetery I do not know how, how Hashem had mercy on me, it was a miracle I.., that, that day, Yom Kippur, it was the end, the end of my life I saw how.. I remained alive, I do not know Such a Yom Kippur That is what I had And my wife.. I went out of the house, so she thought: I am coming, coming, coming, then she saw.. then it was already necessary.. already before the fast, I am not coming; the point is: she, she thought presumably I.., presumably traveled to Meron, presumably traveled to Meron, and that is how it was It disturbed her very much “If so, then my father is right, such a sick person, and he does not take care that he should not be with illness” the point is: she dragged, decided out of troubles, from the magnitude of the anguish, from what she saw

“I am bringing the world to talk,” {..} At any rate, {…} she thought: “Perhaps.. perhaps.. indeed.. perhaps to make a get This is not a person, such a sick man traveled to Meron, does not say, does not say anything,” {..} The point is: she {dragged] it out, decided on the eve of Yom Kippur After Yom Kippur Rebbe Yisroel brought me.. It was, in short, she decided, she decided.. decided, {..} And Rebbe Yisroel, ah.. there in the dwelling there was, there was a neighbor, a close neighbor, door to door With another J.., with another Jew who was.. a great Torah scholar And he sat day and night in the shul and would learn, learn diligently {Yes, indeed} [..]… ...[Yes, he sat and learned diligently, the..] Yes, day and night [Day and night] He was a great.., a great Torah scholar, he was a lamdan, sat always in the shul And his wife was, his spouse, his wife would bring him a little tea, a little coffee, food like that His home, it was the shul Only that he would go at night, late at night {…} to sleep, afterward he was.. “constantly in the shul” This Jew was called: Reb Avraham’le, he was called: Reb Avraham’le [Reb Avraham’le] Yes He had a daughter, he married off the daughter, and this daughter was a friend of her sister.. with my wife And this Reb Avraham’le, ah.. {..}, my, my, th.. my wife held very highly of Reb Avraham’le She regarded him like an angel of Hashem The point is, he told her: “That she should not look at anything” {….}, and Reb Avraham.. “And Rebbe Yisroel is a God-fearing Jew, and.. and.. and.. not to make an issue of his having become Breslover” She listened only to Reb Avraham’le The point is: now that she, that she, had regrets, it is like.., there is no one with whom to live..

Such a, such a.. she says The point is, th.. he, he, then he said: “That she should be yielding, that she should be..” At any rate, this is my wife [{..}, so Rebbe Yisroel, you were in the middle of telling me about Rebbe Yisroel, what did Rebbe Yisroel do?] {..}, what did you say to me? {..} [So you told me that Rebbe Yisroel.. Kardonner, what did he do?] He was a neighbor of Reb Avraham [Yes] A neighbor of this Jew And this Jew.. he was an “only one” in Tzfas in that he was not oppos.., he He was a God-fearing Jew, a Torah scholar, a neighbor of Rebbe Yisroel, he did not consent to opposition In the shul were all the opponents, in the synagogue where he was, {..}, and.. and.. and.. and.. he himself did not, {…} And nevertheless I wondered how he did not become a Breslover chassid Such, such a Jew, and he has a neighbor, Rebbe Yisroel, how does he not go in to Rebbe Yisroel on Thursday night, {yes} But so, so is the world, so is this world . Drawing close to Rabbainu is one of the difficult things [In truth] If he becomes a “Breslover,” then there will be no “Reb Avraham’le,” he will no longer be “of distinguished lineage” {…} I saw how strong the truth is, and this, this is a known thing “The lamdan” does not {“count with him”} in chass.., in chassidus, in religiosity (frumkeit) Only.. “let us see, let us see how much of a lamdan” “To shoot, to shoot, lamdanus entirely, to shoot” Nu, but, and.. and I, and I was not a lamdan, only a simple man, and nevertheless Reb Avraham’le.. [A simple man, doubled, tripled, quadrupled] They saw, they saw such truth, such self-sacrifice that I showed So he.. so he subm.., ah.. so he.. sub.., humbled himself, so he.. did not become an opponent, {…}

{Nu}, afterward {..}, afterward.. {..} After Yom Kippur I arrived home, and.. {..} I had been in Meron But, nu, precisely after Yom Kippur, after such a journey there and back Then there was no taxi, they traveled with donkeys Then I was so weak, there was such an illness, the heart.. the heart and the intestines, it is a dangerous thing, it is a known thing, and Hashem had mercy, it became better, and better, and better, {….} and the illness went away without any doctor, without anything, {…} And this Yom Kippur I remember all the days of my life, {….} I was already in that world there, in Meron {..…..} I was almost not in this world . And.. and after that I saw miracles, that Hashem helped me, that I had a recovery without any doctor {But}.., I attributed it to the merit of Rebbe Shimon, because I traveled to Meron Precisely because I traveled to Meron and had self-sacrifice, I gave so much money and arrived in Meron And it seems to me that I did not do well, and afterward he shouted: “No, you did do well” [Self-sacrifice, Rabbainu] {...yes…}, {………..} [What else do you remember from that period?] Eh? [What else do you remember?] What else do I remember? [Yes] {..}.. I will tell you, I will tell you the story of how I was in the desert Where there was no natural way at all to come out alive, but, but {.…..} I was in the desert, {..}, no water, no food, and this is the story of the desert I will tell you the main points from the beginning [No, everything] Eh? [There is time] There is time, but.. [You told me that you do not tell anything..] {...} [Until you know a matter clearly, Rebbe Yisroel] Oy, oy, oy, oy, oy…

...[You needed to wait until today to say everything? Then you need to say everything, you know..] The story of the desert was like this: {…} My drawing close to the holy Rabbainu, to Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) Hashem Yisbarach made it that it was during.. the World War, it was.. Not in the year.., a year of drought, there was hunger, there was hunger At any rate, I.., this is how it was: My mother passed away in the house of Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) I saw that such things stood before me, I said to Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner): "No.., I have.., I have fear perhaps, perhaps, that I will not be able to hold out" So we came to an agreement: "That we should make a handclasp, {….} then.. then.. so that the bond should not be torn We need to see one another every day and every night, whether studying, not studying But to see one another, we need to see one another, need to see one another So that we will not be far from one another, from one another, this one in this city, and this one in this city So that we will not be far, we need to see one another every day and every night" Such a handclasp At any rate, this was.. {…}, at any rate, ah.. After the.. after the wedding, after.. then like this: Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) arrived in Teveria, af.., af.., after I saw such, such wonders How he.. went, went from Meron to.., to Teveria, Hashem brought him from Meron to Teveria a.. to me, to the house He saw such providence, he found such a soul longing for the truth Longing for the service of Hashem, with self-sacrifice For him it was one of the grea.., greatest of all things He left Meron, left Tzfas, no family, no.. no.., no children, no family, nothing Only Teveria and Yisroel Ber, only the two things At any rate, Pesach is going to arrive, he.. he.. he brought the family to.. to Teveria

Who will pay for it? One needs to pay for the donkey, he wrote to them that they should come to Teveria There is no money to pay for the apartment, no money to pay for transporting by donkey, {and he.., yes} She and the children needed two donkeys {..}, nu, good, she came to go, she has nowhere to enter, he has no apartment, and.. and Pesach is arriving Where does one hear such a thing? At any rate, he brought her to.., brought her to Teveria, and Hashem provided.., Hashem provided an apartment There was one who gave {..}, who rented out an apartment, and he was in Teveria, so he became a "Teverian" Just as Yisroel Ber was a "Teverian," so Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) became.. a "Teverian" He brought the wife and the children to Teveria Shoyn, the time arrived when I needed to get married, it was Elul {This …. notice}, we were in contact from Chanukah until Elul, almost a year, {…} The father and the mother were happy, they were happy that I was going to get married in.. in Tzfas And Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) became a "Teverian" Nu, so he will be a "Teverian," and I will be a "Tzfasite," shoyn, so consequently he will not be a "Breslover" Nu, they were happy that I was going to get married in Tzfas, and Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) a "Teverian" He has an apartment in Teveria, and he lives in Teveria, so he is a "Teverian," nu Shoyn, after this, the day they traveled to the wedding with donkeys, {..}, ah.. Then on the way the mother says: "Baruch Hashem, {….}, M.., Master of the World, the Master of the World has compassion Now, now, now you will be in Tzfas and Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) will be in Teveria, this is very good" It was several {…}, several, several.. several donkeys that traveled The point is: We traveled half an hour, fro.., from behind us came.. Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner).., he traveled with another {……….} he took the wife and the children, Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner), on donkeys it was on that same day, he has a "handclasp," one needs to see one another every day – "to Tzfas" Yisroel Ber is traveling to get married, traveling to Tzfas, so he becomes a "Tzfasite"

When Yisroel Ber was in Teveria he was a "Teverian" Now that he is traveling to Tzfas, to get married, then he needs to be in Tzfas Where have we heard such a thing..? Such, such a story to tell? That he found Yisroel Ber who wants to serve Hashem, who wants.., who wants to serve Hashem, he already left all the forms of service, left Meron, left family, left everything Now that I am traveling to get married in Tzfas, then he returned to being a "Tzfasite" The point is: My mother saw, saw that they arrived {……} half an hour {…………..……..} everyone together on donkeys, my mother saw.. That Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner), with the wife, with the children, were also traveling to the wedding Nu, nu At any rate, my wedding was in Meron, we traveled {..} to Tzfas, and the wedding was in Meron {Hashem orchestrated circumstances}, the wedding was in Meron And.. ah.. and.. and.. and Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner).. The wedding was in Meron, he too was.., he too arrived in Meron So he was.. joyous, and Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) danced at the wedding on that Thursday night {……} and his pants fell down, and he did not know, they approached him, stopped him {…...…} [Yes, there were dances from the Upper World.. such dances f.., such a kind..] Indeed [From the Upper World] Yes, his dances were such.. {whatever it is} What I saw, I saw what was happening, but the world saw that his pants fell down At any rate, my father-in-law.. he saw something {…}.. That one needs to go out to war, one needs to go out to war "What does that mean? I will agree to his being a Breslover?" Shoyn, good, Shabbos is the chuppah.., Friday was the chuppah, Shabbos, what can he {.…} After the wedding, Sunday we travel home, {….} the second Shabbos arrives..

The second Shabbos, then {..} my father-in-law, I ate at his place on Friday night, "I ate mezonos at his place" after the food, he takes the key, he locks the door, and.. "Here you will sit, here you will sit, from here you are not going out, on Friday night you are not going to Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner)" the point is, I say to myself: "What is this called, they lock a person in with a key? {What is this?}" Nu, go shout: "Alive and enduring" He locked {….}, and I was, and I was in confinement, unable to go to Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) When it became midnight.. {….} midnight, midnight they go to sleep "Midnight, Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) is already asleep, he is asleep, it is possible to open" {….}, then he went, opened the door The room for me was.., he rented me a room "I ate mezonos at his place," he gave me a room to sleep in, a small room And my room, when I needed to go, when I needed to go out to the street There was a way, a way, through him, through his house From his house {…}, even though he was sure that this late one does not go He sat and watched, sat at the window, sat at the window and.. and watched, {…..} He sat at the window, and I went, and I went, h.. he saw that I was going, so he went: "Gevald, oy.. so late at night and h.., and he is going?" So he went down and.. and.. and chased after me to catch me, to bring me back But I ran ahead of him, I ran faster than he did And I reached Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) and told him the story, that he locked and.. and.. and.. and.. I told, I told everything, I told the story, and said that he, ah.. ah.. he will find me here in {….} he will break everything in the house, he will hit, he.. he.. {….}, already I, I am going back He ran, and I ran from Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner), we had already seen each other, I ran back

So the way, there was a way from Rebbe Yisroel (Kardonner) to him, one had to pass by the shops that sell meat And in the previous years they did not sell the bones, they would throw the bones on.., on the street and the dogs of the city, all the dogs knew there, there {….} There it is {"the bone factory"} Nu, I passed there, all the dogs of Tzfas stood and ate the bones He.. he.. he could not catch me And there among the dogs, there he caught me, he knocked me down onto the dogs {..}, he {…} hit And.. and arrived home.. such a sort of, such a sort of, like this, like this And the order? What is this called?...